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Issues with Second hand F-Pace SVR

1.4K views 20 replies 6 participants last post by  Apollya  
#1 ·
Hi all, opening for info and discussion and for any advice.

I viewed and test drive my new 21 plate SVR back in April or early May.
It was a Quick Look round the vehicle and was in a parking lot quite close to other cars. I did notice something on the rear quarter paint at the time, but when I went to take a photo and mentioned to salesman I then couldn’t see it again.

car was delivered to me last Friday late in the evening, on doing the inspection at handover I noticed this again and could clearly see large flat spots in the paint there and also noticed a large (fist sized) part on the tailgate where it had been repainted very badly and was not level in addition to flats, high and low points. Also noticed a piece (now discovered it’s two pieces) of trim inside the boot were missing on this same side. I also noticed some flat areas of paint on the filler cap and drivers side rear quarter too (this side should polish out). Also the rear light cluster had not been fitted back properly, it’s a tiny bit out of alignment , but this means there’s a squeak when you press on the rear quarter panel, which stops when the rear light is pushed down a little.

I’ve now had the vehicle inspected by an expensive but high quality repairer (JLR authorised for bodywork and paint) they agreed it’s been repainted after damage and the paint shop have not done a good job, they masked up areas rather than follow Jaguar procedures (rear quarter glass, black roof rails should have been removed and all trim around rear quarter glass etc). They could see the paint lines and edges where it’s been missed. We can also see the transition from new paint to original at top of the rear quarter above the glass.

I’m fully able to reject and return for full refund. I’ll be honest the car drives well, sounds great (the engine itself not the soundtrack). The rear quarter panel is actually fitted well, consistent panel gaps and all lined up, only the paint itself is a bit shoddy. We’ve noticed the drivers door has been repaired and repainted too although they’ve actually done a good job there. I spent 2.5-3 months looking for the right SVR, I wanted silver and a very high spec in terms of the options, which this is and was pretty much the only in silver that had everything I wanted. It’s full JLR service history and oil changes in those services every 10k miles (near enough).

I’ve had a quote now from the expensive bodyshop for £4K+ (incl VAT) which frankly although I know they’d do a perfect job I feel is way over the top (more like an inflated insurance quote) for just rear quarter, tailgate issue, 2 clip in trim pieces and the polishing the filler cap and flat spot near it. Waiting for another quote tomorrow from a Jaguar specialist which is expected to be around the 2k mark but it has 2montb wait and they might not be able to do it (paint tech is very ill and might not be working in 2 months).

the dealer is actually part of a very large dealer chain for many brands and they have a Jaguar dealership near them and a Vauxhall one near me.

I’ve said to the dealers manager I’m trying to work with them so know that the quote I’ve got so far is way too high but it does show all the things that need doing, my concern is that it is fixed and done to a good standard of quality.

opening it to discussion and also if anyone knows a very good and reasonably priced body and paint shop in the West Midlands let me know.
 
owns 2023 Jaguar F-Pace SVR 5.0
#2 ·
Assuming you've raised the issue of imperfect paint/missing trim with the dealer, it should just be down to them to have the paint defects fixed, using whoever they use for the repairs. Then to represent the vehicle to you, where you then accept it or reject it. I'd put this in writing to them to so both sides are aware, else it would be a straight reject now.
 
owns 2018 Jaguar F-Pace S
#3 ·
Hey Cutlea, yes discussing with dealer, I’m 140 miles away from them, that was an option but if they did that and returned and I then said it was still not acceptable not in their interest to have car transported all over the place twice or more. We’re both looking into suitable options. He’s contacting one of their local branches to see if they have a good bodyshop they use and I’m looking at other Jaguar alternatives. As then It’s near me and I can insist on It being redone till it is right.
 
owns 2023 Jaguar F-Pace SVR 5.0
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#4 · (Edited)
Just for comparison I got quotes for a small scratch/scrape to my wing by a local bodyshop with a very good reputation, recommended to me by my detailer. That quote was for around ÂŁ1k, about 3 years ago. As you say the proper job includes removal of all glass. I would guess with the additional work to your tailgate you will probably be looking at around 2-3k nowadays.
 
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#5 ·
The real question here is did you get a good price based on the known/unknown defects ? Did the dealer know &/or reveal the vehicle had been repaired? Did you/dealer do a vehicle check before you purchased it ?

Mechanical defects &/or unreported theft/repairs would be grounds for rejecting a car. Not sure if cosmetic opinion is !? Don't know never had to deal with that.

Their is a known problem theft access method that involves cutting a square out of the rear hatch to the right if the number plate recess. Is that where your square is ? If yes check if it was stolen.

Hope you get a result on getting it to the condition you wish for.

I'm a bit more Frenchie in car exterior condition, good mechanicals yes, but scuffs & scrapes happen. Always Pee's me off when I'm driving in the lanes when you meet people in expensive 4x4's that are scared of the hedges!
 
#6 ·
The real question here is did you get a good price based on the known/unknown defects ? Did the dealer know &/or reveal the vehicle had been repaired? Did you/dealer do a vehicle check before you purchased it ?

Mechanical defects &/or unreported theft/repairs would be grounds for rejecting a car. Not sure if cosmetic opinion is !? Don't know never had to deal with that.
So I did get a good price on it but not to reflect accident damage, I queried accident on o/s rear quarter with dealer at the time as I saw something briefly with light at a specific angle, but after couldn’t see it again in the light to take photo or point out to dealer (I questioned was it light playing tricks on me) they claimed repaint doesn’t mean accident damaged or not to know of any and didn’t reveal anything accident repair wise to this effect. It’s only when you know something is there and look closely that all the other paint defects and clear signs of repair start jumping out at you etc, sadly there’s a lot of these small defects where the work has been completed which when seen you can’t unsee.
So it is definitely grounds to reject and the dealer certainly know this, I don’t expect it to be brand new or as like but do expect acceptable quality of any work that has been done. With such poor quality of paint it begs the question was repair done to quality standard. The rear quarter actually looks solid and well aligned, panel gaps and shut lines are consistent, the rear light cluster definitely needs adjustment /alignment but can confirm it’s the light only

I did do various HPI checks, but unless insurance write-off category it will not be listed, so doesn’t help. Also it’s had 2 diff private plates on it over time which makes it harder.

I actually don’t want to reject I want it put right, the colour combo and very high spec on this vehicle was actually hard to find believe it or not, I spent 2.5 months min looking for that right combination.

Their is a known problem theft access method that involves cutting a square out of the rear hatch to the right if the number plate recess. Is that where your square is ? If yes check if it was stolen.
Doesn’t look to be attempted theft as you describe, for the tailgate it’s left side for a start and bottom of tailgate itself, more like paint overspray from repainting rear quarter according to specialists, that or minor ding opening tailgate onto something. That’s not serious and just needs to be made flat and/or polished to that effect.
 
owns 2023 Jaguar F-Pace SVR 5.0
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#7 ·
Sounds like a previous owner damaged the car, or it was damaged in their keep, somehow, and they cheaped-out on a cash repair probably at a local "under-the-arches" type place rather than going through an insurance claim.
 
owns 2018 Jaguar F-Pace S
#8 ·
Yeah that or they had a cheap insurance that insisted on using a cheap place.

Had a mother quote in from a Jaguar specialist indie nearly half price of the first place (suspect I was right that they massively inflate quotes) and got another 2 quotes coming tomorrow from places my main stealer recommended to me one is a local bodyshop to them and the other is another JLR approved body and paint shop.
 
owns 2023 Jaguar F-Pace SVR 5.0
#9 ·
I'd probably be thinking same as you are - you wanted the car to have the right kit, looked long and hard for it, found one, only for it to have paint issues, so get it repainted and keep it.
 
owns 2018 Jaguar F-Pace S
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#11 ·
We’ll update for issues, on Friday the sales manager responded trying to say they will only contribute towards polishing as they don’t think it’s that bad from photos I sent. Obviously it’s not easy to take photos of the paint issues as it’s light and angle dependant and I’m not a professional photographer and only using a phone camera.

Needless to say I’ve responded back quoting consumer rights act and detailing how they have breached it. Not of satisfactory quality and as I specifically asked if it had been in an accident and was advised of none then it is also not as described and mis-selling. It has def been in at least one accident as the drivers door has been repaired (seat is not factory standard) but the repair and paint in this area was not the issue.

I’ve also informed I’ve had the vehicle inspected by 4 bodywork and paint shops now, all who have informed me it’s been repaired and that the o/s rear quarter need to be repainted and cannot be polished out.

i’m looking at my rights under consumer rights act and it seems they cannot force me to reject by refusing to repair unless it is not economical to do so.
 
owns 2023 Jaguar F-Pace SVR 5.0
#12 ·
They cannot force you to reject however they can offer a repair solution that you won't accept, as appears they have, by offering only to polish the paintwork rather than repaint, thus forcing you to reject. Quite how they can dismiss the reports from 4 garages all stating a repaint is required seems impossible, especially as they are basing their response on your poor photographs, their memory of the car and not their first-hand inspection to your complaint. Assuming the dealer ignores your plea for a repaint and their offer of polishing remains the next step is to return the car to the supplying dealer and have them inspect it themselves, if they are not responsive to this then it's back to rejection. You could also use the threat of rejecting the car as bargaining for them to agree the repaint costs. But, see what their response is to your last communication.
 
owns 2018 Jaguar F-Pace S
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#13 ·
Well another update. Dealer is refusing to cover the full costs and has offered literally 1k of a 3.65k quote. After ive suggested I wish to keep the car would contribute to find a mutually acceptable solution, offering I pay the 1.65k and they pay the 2k in order to make it fair for them covering larger share of costs due to of missing trim parts.

latest I’ve said last offer is we split costs directly down the middle but that is final offer and if they chose not to accept then to take the communication as my formal rejection of the vehicle under CRA 2015 as both “Not as described” and “not of satisfactory quality” and for them to collect vehicle at their earliest convenience at a time I am available (business travel means I am out the country a lot in next month). I’ve also informed that in event of rejection I will accept no deductions and will be submitting costs for insurance, road tax and fuel I paid in order to take vehicle to the 4 bodyshops for quotations as I did this having spoken to dealer and literally have not been able to use the car, it’s been sat on my drive hardly used except for trips to bodyshops.

So that’s it either they accept and I keep it with it being fixed to proper quality standard or I’m back on the hunt for an SVR.

It’s left a very bitter taste in my mouth so if it’s rejected I will be ensuring the motor-ombudsman investigate their business practices as they’ve failed to follow law in regards to consumer rights act.
 
owns 2023 Jaguar F-Pace SVR 5.0
#14 ·
It would have been in their interest to have collected the car, had the bodywork rectifications done at a local garage to themselves, which I'm sure they'd have paid a much lesser price, sorted the missing trim and returned the car to you. I don't understand car dealers whose only interest is to shift metal with zero customer satisfaction. And mostly against UK retail law such as offering a 3 month "warranty". Offering to pay some of the cost for the rectifications would very much grate me as the car should have had no more than age related marks else these should have been described at the time of sale, or in the advert. Hopefully the matter will now be resolved to your satisfaction but I wouldn't be so sure they'll play ball with either option you've given them judging by their response to date.
 
owns 2018 Jaguar F-Pace S
#15 ·
Offering to pay some of the cost for the rectifications would very much grate me as the car should have had no more than age related marks else these should have been described at the time of sale, or in the advert. Hopefully the matter will now be resolved to your satisfaction but I wouldn't be so sure they'll play ball with either option you've given them judging by their response to date.
This is exactly how I feel, not happy about offering to contribute, but considering similar spec SVR is 5k more now, I can swallow it on pure financial basis. But this was the deal made at the time with other vehicles around of similar spec to what I paid at the time so the parts that need to be brought up to quality standard were not factored in to offer.

there is a 3month warranty in place but it will not cover faults that were there already and legally cannot remove your consumer rights under CRA 2015. Further being not as described also invalidates any signed sales contract as they have breached it right at the start, so legally they have no legs to stand on.

I also think I may have to fight them, but I can afford it and I am not one to let things go, I will ensure they end up paying out. Perhaps I’m the wrong type of person for them to try and hoodwink, with Jaguar when I had warranty issue way way back I took it right up to the CEO’s office by contact him directly as the Customer Care (CRC) team failed to address my complaints and issues.

none of it will make it resolved to my satisfaction, it shouldn’t have happened in the first place. It’s not like I went to a small dodgy 2nd hand car dealer, this is a main dealer franchise of a large car brand and a large dealership network with many brands in their portfolio including at least one JLR one.
 
owns 2023 Jaguar F-Pace SVR 5.0
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#16 ·
You and I are very alike! I will fight, and hard, if I need to, but sometimes the fight isn't worth it, even if I am in the right, and the overall outcome still comes in my favour. Such as your car will be the exact model with the features you want and with sorted bodywork, for a lesser price then if you had to buy the same car elsewhere, which likely isn't even available anyway, assuming the dealer pays a suitable compensation towards the repairs. But still leaves a bad taste as it shouldn't have got to this in the first place!
 
owns 2018 Jaguar F-Pace S
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#17 ·
Yeah I think we are very alike, certainly on how we think about our rights and knowing when to stand up for them. We’re also both technically minded and research things, albeit you are massively more adept and knowledgeable on vehicle mechanicals than I likely ever will be. I am at least interested and want to learn and do things myself where possible, it’s not about cost savings at all for me, it’s about the technical challenge and self-improvement / learning I might get out of it.
 
owns 2023 Jaguar F-Pace SVR 5.0
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#18 ·
Sounds like a case for Trading Standards IF the dealer doesn't come to their senses and start using some of the common variety. I read that the OP is quite determined to fight the fight regardless of cost if necessary but would urge contacting the local TS first. Relevant info can be found on the NTS site where they cite the following as their priorities......

Used cars
This work is primarily delivered at a local level with several investigations supported by NTS. These have helped deal with some of the most complained about traders. Market disruption activities have been focussed on market enablers, for example mileage adjustment service providers. We have developed guidance for local authority trading standards officers on sources of data on mileage and vehicle history.

Other fair trading issues
Regional and national teams have taken on several successful cases dealing with misdescriptions, such as those arising from advertising pricing, descriptions of goods and services, terms and conditions, fraud and money laundering offences relating to national/regional traders.

HTH.
 
#19 ·
Sounds like a case for Trading Standards IF the dealer doesn't come to their senses and start using some of the common variety
Thanks mate, well aware of trading standards a lot of my research into my rights comes from there and other sources and as you say if they do not come to their senses will be making official reports to them and the motor ombudsman which this garage sign up to.
 
owns 2023 Jaguar F-Pace SVR 5.0
#20 ·
And that’s the formal rejection letter sent, within the first 30days.

I hadn’t received any reply to my very generous offer of paying half out of my own pocket to get it resolved, seemed like they were trying to stall and let the clock run taking too long for every reply, not sure if it’s the head of sales had no authority or was just doing it deliberately.

Now we’ll see if they do the right thing as demanded of them by U.K. Law or if they try and cause more issues and force me to make it legal.
 
owns 2023 Jaguar F-Pace SVR 5.0
#21 ·
Well credit to the dealer they’ve done the right thing, they accepted the rejection and have even accepted they need to pay for the fuel I put in (to take to body shops for quotations), the insurance costs and the two months road tax (was owned by me less than 30 days but this ran over two months and the dvla do not refund any part months so you dont get refund for both those months).

I’ve not received it back in my acc yet, but have a signed transfer document stating the full amount. Hopefully it’s processed tomorrow, at least this is what I was informed this morning.
 
owns 2023 Jaguar F-Pace SVR 5.0